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Creating spells/skills

Those colorful people.

Posts: 186

Joined: Wed Jun 11, 2014 9:14 pm

Post Wed Jan 07, 2015 10:53 am

Creating spells/skills

Just curious... And I know already that Arcaenum has been the only guild allowed to create new spells for the game, whether its for their own guild or for the game itself. I also know that it was intended that other guilds approached Arcaenum in terms of seeing a new spell introduced to the game for that guild's benefit etc.

However, I also think other guilds should have the ability to at least create or build on their own respective guild RP/spells/skills. As an example; I don't just see Gypsy as a guild for players who want to RP a family/outcast looking for a home/sufferers of tragedy looking for a fresh start to their lives. I also see Gypsy as magical people, enriched with stories and wisdom.

Why can't they create their own spells for their guild. e.g. Evil eye? A popular myth in gypsy lore.

I'm not suggesting a whole free range of spell research like Arcaenum has, as they ARE scholars of elite magic. But I am suggesting guilds and clans (As I've heard clans will have a liberal approach to clan spells etc.) should have a right to create guild/clan RP friendly spells without consulting Arcaenum.

I personally don't see Gypsy coming up to Arcaenum asking for them to help them create spells, nor do I expect a scholar asking gypsy to show them how to make spells via Gypsy magic.

I posted this, as it also relates to the possibilities extended to Clans. As I already said, I've heard they will have great liberty in terms of forming their clans, and that includes the potential spells/skills they will get.

Just a thought. Don't be scared to criticize.
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Posts: 124

Joined: Sun Aug 24, 2014 12:26 pm

Post Fri Jan 09, 2015 3:29 pm

Re: Creating spells/skills

Hrobshur wrote:Arcaenum has been the only guild allowed to create new spells for the game, whether its for their own guild or for the game itself.

Have they ever actually created a spell for the entire game to use, though? I can't think of any spells that have ever actually been introduced lately, much less from Arc. Wonder how much coding, writing, and effort's went into spells maybe 2 people ever got to use.

Hrobshur wrote:I'm not suggesting a whole free range of spell research like Arcaenum has, as they ARE scholars of elite magic.

If someone wants to research magic like Arcaenum without being in Arcaenum, why shouldn't they get to?

In a bigger sense, I hate how this is even a discussion. If a new spell or skill addition would make the game better or a guild more desirable, how about we just get it? Yes, things are better when they're RPed out and have a quest line or story involved in them, but "okay, join/ask Arcaenum and do it" feels like a cheap, inconsistently-applied way to dismiss somebody's idea. There wasn't a quest or RP involved for each class suddenly getting ID/Locate O or kick suddenly getting better for clerics/bards, but THAT thing? Slow down there buddy, you have to EARN that.

Some stuff we just... get. Other stuff demands a plot, and there's no telling which thing's going to ask for it.

Posts: 186

Joined: Wed Jun 11, 2014 9:14 pm

Post Fri Jan 09, 2015 10:13 pm

Re: Creating spells/skills

Because its an RP mud.

I whole heartedly, Arcaenum has a right to be exclusive. Sorry if you don't like that truth. But its truth. IF a scholar in arcaenum wants to make a spell for their class to use, they have a right to. IF they want it to be exclusively for Arc, again they have a right to.

My original post centres around other guilds and clans being able to create spells which fit their RP. How about they be allowed to give that a shot. There is a vast work load in creating spells. IF the a guild of scholars wanting to make a spell has to go through so much effort RPly and research wise. It's only fair the rest have to do the same for their betterment. Not just handed down a free spell to encourage RP.

You have spoken a lot about players becoming the forerunners of their own RP, and creating stories for all to share. You've said that takes effort, but the pay off is grand. Well, its the exact same with making new spells/skills.

And frankly, I don't care if you hate Arcaenum, or how they operate. That's your perception.

I'm talking about letting a guild like Gypsy, who I see as a mystical group of people making their own spells through gypsy blood and gypsy lore. It's only fair they have to do a similar process in getting that spell/skill.

Posts: 186

Joined: Wed Jun 11, 2014 9:14 pm

Post Fri Jan 09, 2015 11:05 pm

Re: Creating spells/skills

id and locate object and kick were talked about in an OOC discussion long ago.

identify was deemed more OOC than IC. Locate object was deemed a convenient spell which was necessary to add to classes who didn't have them before. Because other classes with them, had an advantage in certain quests or just in general.

Kick was changed to bruise for bards and clerics because what's the point having a nerfed kick? The consensus of the discussion most agreed to it being changed.

In terms of guilds and clans getting new spells out of thin air. First of all. Guilds are IC. So getting a spell or skill out of thin air boggles me. This thread is focused on wanting to see if people want to put the effort in RP which focuses on them getting new spells centred on their guild's RP. And these spells could be passive or aggressive. I don't know. That's up to guilds like Gypsy, Aequitas, dawning and CR to decide.

Again I will say it. You might hate Arcaenum, and then whine that in the past DR has always pointed people to RP with Arc to get a new spell. Well, I'm countering that, with why not allow guilds to make their own spells REVELANT TO THEIR GUILD'S RP.

E.g. I know Crimson Rain has always had only two guild spells - Terror and their glory spell.
But they have a host of houses which form CR. Surely, each one of those houses could RP and research a specific house spell, which focuses on that HOUSE's RP concept.

E.g. Gypsy only have two guild spells Shadows and their glory spell. IF they still have three factions within the foundations of Gypsy, why not each faction could RP and research a spell focused on that faction's function.

I'm not whining about what has happened in the past or the game either.. I'm trying to see what interests people and what we can work on to improve DR as a whole for everyone to enjoy.
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Posts: 159

Joined: Fri Jun 06, 2014 9:25 pm

Post Fri Jan 09, 2015 11:19 pm

Re: Creating spells/skills

I don't see where disagreeing with Arcaenum's 'perk' = hating Arcaenum. I had a very active Arcaenum alt who rose to Acharya for a very long time. And for all the effort/work I put in, I never -ever- had the ability to 'create' a spell. Arcaenum got the best case scenario of an active imm who could code and was willing to code, and this 'spell-crafting' came about. Looking at Arcaenum 'back then' and Arcaenum now - I see no reason why scholars should get their own spells. It's a HUGE perk that I've never (and I realize that since I'm not active in Arcaenum, I can't say this with authority) seen anyone actually do enough to 'earn'. It's a lot of effort for one person to get a spell when there's so much else to be addressed that affects the entire game. I agree it's 'wasteful' compared to the other things that could be worked on over all. I've also not seen an Arc get a spell since that gravy-train died, so maybe we're in a better place in terms of priority now.

Having said that - I'm also not aware of any guild not being able to petition to get a new spell/change a spell. It's simply never happened, and that's in the hands of the admins. Maybe the right idea hasn't come up yet. Maybe they don't want to. Gypsy is a great example, because compared to other guilds, they get the **** end of the stick (Dawning a close second, who have an awesome spell they're not allowed to use). I know in the 12 years I've played, ideas like 'Evil Eye', Gypsy Curse, etc have been floated several times - and each time, shot down. I know a while back a new Dawning kit was approved... and nothing happened with it.

Posts: 248

Joined: Wed Jun 11, 2014 1:54 am

Post Sat Jan 10, 2015 12:21 am

Re: Creating spells/skills

My main issue with guilds/clans being able to create their own spells/skills is that possibility of creating overpowered stuff.

Now I'm completely fine with characters creating RP-related spells/skills.
Hell! I sure hope they do get that sort of stuff because they require some sssserious RPing.

The moment they create anything that boosts (directly or indirectly) their PvM or PvP, it becomes a problem.

Want to make certain class/race better? Make a general suggestion, at least that way everyone can benefit from it.

Posts: 186

Joined: Wed Jun 11, 2014 9:14 pm

Post Sat Jan 10, 2015 1:00 am

Re: Creating spells/skills

It's a fair point with PvP and Pvm.

But I'm sure with anything that can be created it has to be submitted to IMP for approval. At least giving clans and guilds the opportunity to offer researched ideas for spells/skills gives them a better chance of getting it, than just asking or suggesting it should happen, because its RP related to their guild/clan.

But this is just a suggestion thread. By no means am I suggesting it become implemented and carried forward.

If people don't like it. That's fine. That's what this forum is for.
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Posts: 124

Joined: Sun Aug 24, 2014 12:26 pm

Post Sat Jan 10, 2015 5:27 pm

Re: Creating spells/skills

Hrobshur wrote:At least giving clans and guilds the opportunity to offer researched ideas for spells/skills gives them a better chance of getting it

No, it doesn't. You can RP your head off and you will never get your new ability until admins and coder decide to actually put it in. The previous attempts at new abilities, all the Gypsy Evil Eye ideas throughout the years and the Dawning Kit? They never GOT to the "research/RP it out" phase, the concepts died before they ever truly got in motion. And I'll be damned if I sit down and take my time to "research" a spell to have nothing happen in the same way petitioning for it makes nothing happen.

The point of failure here is not on the player side.

Posts: 150

Joined: Sat Jun 07, 2014 11:03 pm

Post Wed Jan 14, 2015 6:22 pm

Re: Creating spells/skills

One of the spells I was researching while in Arcaenum wasn't an Arcaenum specific spells. As it stands, if we summon a pet and release it(nofollow...attack it, whatever), we are simply out of mana. My rp was to create a spell that would allow you to release the summoned animal and regain mana based on the time it had remaining before it disappeared on its own. There were other coding priorities at the time, so I didn't get very far into it.

That being said, I don't have a huge problem with letting guilds/clans create spells. If it DOES affect pvp/pvm then we'll have to ensure it's properly balanced. If it's an RP spell(for instance the Arcaenum conjure familiar spell)....why not? What's it hurting? It may be a side-project for the coder if he's busy with other things, but most spells aren't *that* difficult to code as far as I am aware...particularly if it doesn't require pvp considerations!

Posts: 80

Joined: Sat Jan 17, 2015 11:07 am

Post Tue Jan 20, 2015 10:51 am

Re: Creating spells/skills

I'm with Kiir on the "why not?" of this all up to a point. Any RP spell that doesn't affect pvp/pvm, awesome. Why would anyone object?

If it does affect pvp/pvm, then hey, balance is already thrown off: unguilded players are inherently disadvantaged. That's just truth. Like, big shrug there; learned to live with that ages ago. At the same time, though, I think clans are a good in-between for addressing that imbalance: don't like the existing guild RPs? Create your own.

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